PrimeGrid
Please visit donation page to help the project cover running costs for this month

Toggle Menu

Join PrimeGrid

Returning Participants

Community

Leader Boards

Results

Other

drummers-lowrise

Advanced search

Message boards : Project Staging Area : FFT size for factorials and primorials

Author Message
Profile BurProject donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 25 Feb 20
Posts: 511
ID: 1241833
Credit: 407,815,873
RAC: 7,696
321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,092,823)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,315,295)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,151,088)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,620,968)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,943,107)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,064,832)SoB LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,434,466)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,065,004)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,027,649)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,089,856)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,112,258)321 Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,107,153)PPS Sieve Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,096,952)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,797,662)GFN Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,874,159)WW Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (349,980,000)PSA Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,042,601)
Message 146064 - Posted: 3 Dec 2020 | 17:50:51 UTC

There seem to be some versions of pfgw that support multithreading and I was wondering if it'd be worth already to look into it for current factorials/primorials in PSA.

But apparently, pfgw doesn't output the FFT size. Does anyone know it or how to get the FFT size from the respective number by other means?
____________
1281979 * 2^485014 + 1 is prime ... no further hits up to: n = 5,700,000

rogue
Volunteer developer
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 8 Sep 07
Posts: 1246
ID: 12001
Credit: 18,565,548
RAC: 0
PPS LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (31,229)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (18,533,435)
Message 146534 - Posted: 11 Dec 2020 | 13:15:11 UTC - in response to Message 146064.

There seem to be some versions of pfgw that support multithreading and I was wondering if it'd be worth already to look into it for current factorials/primorials in PSA.

But apparently, pfgw doesn't output the FFT size. Does anyone know it or how to get the FFT size from the respective number by other means?


Use the command line switch of -V and it will print the FFT size for each test.

Profile BurProject donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 25 Feb 20
Posts: 511
ID: 1241833
Credit: 407,815,873
RAC: 7,696
321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,092,823)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,315,295)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,151,088)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,620,968)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,943,107)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,064,832)SoB LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,434,466)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,065,004)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,027,649)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,089,856)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,112,258)321 Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,107,153)PPS Sieve Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,096,952)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,797,662)GFN Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,874,159)WW Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (349,980,000)PSA Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,042,601)
Message 146580 - Posted: 12 Dec 2020 | 6:48:19 UTC - in response to Message 146534.

Thanks!

In case anyone else is interested:

n!+-1 n FFT 100,000 160K 250,000 448K 500,000 896K 750,000 1440K 1,000,000 1920K 1,250,000 2560K 1,500,000 3000K 1,750,000 3584K 2,000,000 4000K


n#+-1 n FFT 1,250,000 192K 1,750,000 256K 2,500,000 384K 3,000,000 448K 4,000,000 640K 5,000,000 768K 7,500,000 1120K 10,000,000 1536K 20,000,000 3000K

So it will take some years at PSA until MT might begin to make sense even on older CPUs.


pfgw also outputs the number of bits, is that actually the size on powers of two? Then it'd be easy to calculate the number of digits if a prime is found.
____________
1281979 * 2^485014 + 1 is prime ... no further hits up to: n = 5,700,000

rogue
Volunteer developer
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 8 Sep 07
Posts: 1246
ID: 12001
Credit: 18,565,548
RAC: 0
PPS LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (31,229)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (18,533,435)
Message 146601 - Posted: 12 Dec 2020 | 14:23:17 UTC - in response to Message 146580.

Note that the FFT sizes are dependent upon the CPU as not all FFT routines are available on all CPUs.

PRPNet computes the decimal length of primorials and factorials when loaded into the database, so if a prime is found the length on the User Primes page will be the actual decimal length.

But you can use the number of bits to estimate the decimal length. I don't recall if it is the exact number of bits.

Profile BurProject donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 25 Feb 20
Posts: 511
ID: 1241833
Credit: 407,815,873
RAC: 7,696
321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,092,823)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,315,295)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,151,088)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,620,968)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,943,107)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,064,832)SoB LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,434,466)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,065,004)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,027,649)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,089,856)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,112,258)321 Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,107,153)PPS Sieve Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,096,952)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,797,662)GFN Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,874,159)WW Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (349,980,000)PSA Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,042,601)
Message 149289 - Posted: 9 Mar 2021 | 18:43:41 UTC - in response to Message 146601.

I recently learned that to estimate whether a calculation fits into L3 cache the FFT size should be multiplied by 8.

Factorial primes are around 450K FFT size now, that'd be 3.6 MB of L3 cache required. Is that really the case? If so, contrary to what I wrote before, multi threading would be recommended on most CPUs. But as far as I know openPFGW doesn't support MT, or does it?
____________
1281979 * 2^485014 + 1 is prime ... no further hits up to: n = 5,700,000

Profile JeppeSNProject donor
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 5 Apr 14
Posts: 1696
ID: 306875
Credit: 40,834,494
RAC: 11,833
Found 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de Primes321 LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (593,283)Cullen LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (611,298)ESP LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (174,818)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (112,799)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,993,768)PSP LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (428,457)SoB LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (466,812)SR5 LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (210,142)SGS LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (112,277)TRP LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (342,501)Woodall LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (109,455)321 Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (175,037)PPS Sieve Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (10,113)AP 26/27 Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (12,129)GFN Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,228,147)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,640,000)PSA Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,614,290)
Message 149290 - Posted: 9 Mar 2021 | 22:00:57 UTC - in response to Message 149289.

But as far as I know openPFGW doesn't support MT, or does it?

No, it does not. /JeppeSN

Profile Michael GoetzProject donor
Volunteer moderator
Project administrator
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 21 Jan 10
Posts: 13788
ID: 53948
Credit: 345,142,938
RAC: 12,033
The "Shut up already!" badge:  This loud mouth has mansplained on the forums over 10 thousand times!  Sheesh!!!Discovered the World's First GFN-19 prime!!!Discovered 2 mega primesFound 1 prime in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2019 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 2 primes in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 2 primes in the 2022 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2022 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2022 Tour de Primes Mountain Stage321 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,638,389)Cullen LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,038,114)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,177,890)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,094,541)PPS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (23,416,635)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,956,186)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (36,067,618)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (12,645,567)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,036,951)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,084,329)Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,032,821)321 Sieve (suspended) Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,061,196)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,170,256)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,059,304)PPS Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (22,885,121)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,035,522)TRP Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,051,121)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,902,645)GFN Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (92,455,703)WW Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (65,888,000)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (12,445,029)
Message 149294 - Posted: 10 Mar 2021 | 0:27:13 UTC - in response to Message 149290.

But as far as I know openPFGW doesn't support MT, or does it?

No, it does not. /JeppeSN


Actually, it does -- at least if you use the correct version. But faking things such that PRPNet uses it is non-trivial.

You'll want the 4.x.x release of PFGW to do multithreading. I know others have managed to finagle PRPNet into running LLR multithreaded, but I don't know if anyone did it with PFGW. Search the forums for advice if you want to try it.
____________
My lucky number is 75898524288+1

Profile JeppeSNProject donor
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 5 Apr 14
Posts: 1696
ID: 306875
Credit: 40,834,494
RAC: 11,833
Found 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de Primes321 LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (593,283)Cullen LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (611,298)ESP LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (174,818)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (112,799)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,993,768)PSP LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (428,457)SoB LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (466,812)SR5 LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (210,142)SGS LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (112,277)TRP LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (342,501)Woodall LLR Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (109,455)321 Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (175,037)PPS Sieve Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (10,113)AP 26/27 Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (12,129)GFN Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,228,147)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,640,000)PSA Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,614,290)
Message 149324 - Posted: 10 Mar 2021 | 22:10:08 UTC - in response to Message 149294.

But as far as I know openPFGW doesn't support MT, or does it?

No, it does not. /JeppeSN


Actually, it does -- at least if you use the correct version. But faking things such that PRPNet uses it is non-trivial.

You'll want the 4.x.x release of PFGW to do multithreading. I know others have managed to finagle PRPNet into running LLR multithreaded, but I don't know if anyone did it with PFGW. Search the forums for advice if you want to try it.


You are right! I checked a version 3.8.3 I had. I see now, the version 4 has a -T switch for multithreading. /JeppeSN

Profile OdicinProject donor
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 30 May 10
Posts: 126
ID: 61485
Credit: 564,237,086
RAC: 67,059
Eliminated 2 conjecture "k"s321 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,072,038)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (3,020,655)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (3,032,701)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (3,642,032)PPS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (24,308,419)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,111,045)SoB LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,356,994)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (14,561,710)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,001,771)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,581,777)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,001,090)321 Sieve (suspended) Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,055,595)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (27,076,246)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (3,607,166)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (241,990,464)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,054,368)TRP Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,010,272)AP 26/27 Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (55,033,316)GFN Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (127,106,167)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,376,000)PSA Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,237,603)
Message 151060 - Posted: 9 Aug 2021 | 6:08:39 UTC - in response to Message 149294.
Last modified: 9 Aug 2021 | 6:13:27 UTC

I know others have managed to finagle PRPNet into running LLR multithreaded, but I don't know if anyone did it with PFGW. Search the forums for advice if you want to try it.


Confirmed. It also works with pfgw 4.0 or newer in the same way like llr. (Original instructions here)

Instead of changing the "llrexe=" in prpclient.ini, you change the "pfgwexe=" line with the created batch file.

In the batch file, you only write the line:
@pfgw64.exe %* -T4


Change the number in your desired number of cores.

Before, you must update the pfgw.exe file with a newer version (>4.0) than the included version in the prpnet package.

Regards Odi
____________

Profile BurProject donor
Volunteer tester
Avatar
Send message
Joined: 25 Feb 20
Posts: 511
ID: 1241833
Credit: 407,815,873
RAC: 7,696
321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,092,823)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,315,295)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,151,088)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,620,968)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,943,107)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,064,832)SoB LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,434,466)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,065,004)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,027,649)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,089,856)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,112,258)321 Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,107,153)PPS Sieve Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,096,952)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,797,662)GFN Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,874,159)WW Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (349,980,000)PSA Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,042,601)
Message 151068 - Posted: 9 Aug 2021 | 16:53:17 UTC
Last modified: 9 Aug 2021 | 17:05:33 UTC

Thanks, that's much easier than I expected.

FFT is currently at 480K, so modern CPUs won't benefit from multithreading yet. I tested my laptop Ryzen 5 2500U and up to 1500K single-threaded still had the most throughput - I have to admit I'm a bit surprised by that, as it only has 4 MB of L3 cache, so maybe the tests were screwed up by something.

If it was correct, it's way out of the range PRPnet will likely ever reach. But the more I think about it, the less I trust the results. My Ryzen 9 3600X went better with 2 threads at around 640k if I remember correctly.

Hmm, kind of pointless post now, but I leave it here for the record. ;)
____________
1281979 * 2^485014 + 1 is prime ... no further hits up to: n = 5,700,000

Post to thread

Message boards : Project Staging Area : FFT size for factorials and primorials

[Return to PrimeGrid main page]
DNS Powered by DNSEXIT.COM
Copyright © 2005 - 2022 Rytis Slatkevičius (contact) and PrimeGrid community. Server load 0.24, 0.75, 1.47
Generated 7 Jul 2022 | 1:44:41 UTC