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Message boards : General discussion : The game changer: The Playstation 4

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sHENzheN
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Message 70839 - Posted: 13 Nov 2013 | 7:49:52 UTC
Last modified: 13 Nov 2013 | 7:52:17 UTC

As most of you know the playstation 4 will come with cloud computing capabilities as well as of course a system that gives you nearly two teraflops processing speed for about 400 dollars U.S. The point of this thread is to ask the following questions to those of you who are much smarter and informed that I am.

1) It seems the PS4 will be able to be used for cloud computing projects by private developers and so will PrimeGrid develop software (Or one of you guys) develop software like how the PS3 had it?

2) PS3 was a game changer for projects such as Folding@home will the PS4 do this for Primegrid?

3) Obviously you can tell by now Im no techie guy by any stretch but for 400 dollars for a system that gives you nearly 2 teraflop processing power it seems to me (a layman) that the ps4 seems to be a cheap way of contributing to Primegrid. What do you think?


The only reason I would buy a ps4 at my age (29) would be to contribute to a distributed computing project. In fact like many of you its more of a hobby and passion. Like how some people collect cards or stamps many of us like to contribute to our computing cause in some way through finding ways (and money) to buy more processing power and increase our output.

I mean whats to stop me one day from eventually owning a 10 rack ps4 workstation that crunch for 8 hours or more per day. I live in China at the moment and electricity is quite cheap here compared to the states so energy usage isnt so much an issue here as it is back home in the states.

Anyways please feel free to correct incorrect assumptions I may have set up with my questions or logic. Again Im a layman with technical things so if you have some technical geek talk just break it down and talk to me as if I were a child. ^_^ Thank you

Profile Michael GoetzProject donor
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The "Shut up already!" badge:  This loud mouth has mansplained on the forums over 10 thousand times!  Sheesh!!!Discovered the World's First GFN-19 prime!!!Discovered 1 mega primeFound 1 prime in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2019 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de Primes321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,822,730)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,005,249)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,009,577)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,145,754)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,409,150)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,197,957)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (34,291,181)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,007,110)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,276,330)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,084,329)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,195,123)321 Sieve Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,061,196)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,170,256)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,059,304)PPS Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (22,885,121)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,035,522)TRP Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,051,121)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,118,303)GFN Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (74,478,271)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (12,445,029)
Message 70840 - Posted: 13 Nov 2013 | 11:56:20 UTC

With the PS3, Sony went out of their way to block Linux (and hence BOINC) from running on their system after it had been used for crunching for a year or more. Maybe it will be different this time around.

I don't know if they'll allow Linux to run. Perhaps they'll have their own, proprietary OS that BOINC can be ported to. We'll have to wait and see.
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Message 70841 - Posted: 13 Nov 2013 | 12:43:19 UTC - in response to Message 70839.

As most of you know the playstation 4 will come with cloud computing capabilities as well as of course a system that gives you nearly two teraflops processing speed for about 400 dollars U.S. The point of this thread is to ask the following questions to those of you who are much smarter and informed that I am.

1) It seems the PS4 will be able to be used for cloud computing projects by private developers and so will PrimeGrid develop software (Or one of you guys) develop software like how the PS3 had it?

2) PS3 was a game changer for projects such as Folding@home will the PS4 do this for Primegrid?

3) Obviously you can tell by now Im no techie guy by any stretch but for 400 dollars for a system that gives you nearly 2 teraflop processing power it seems to me (a layman) that the ps4 seems to be a cheap way of contributing to Primegrid. What do you think?


The only reason I would buy a ps4 at my age (29) would be to contribute to a distributed computing project. In fact like many of you its more of a hobby and passion. Like how some people collect cards or stamps many of us like to contribute to our computing cause in some way through finding ways (and money) to buy more processing power and increase our output.

I mean whats to stop me one day from eventually owning a 10 rack ps4 workstation that crunch for 8 hours or more per day. I live in China at the moment and electricity is quite cheap here compared to the states so energy usage isnt so much an issue here as it is back home in the states.

Anyways please feel free to correct incorrect assumptions I may have set up with my questions or logic. Again Im a layman with technical things so if you have some technical geek talk just break it down and talk to me as if I were a child. ^_^ Thank you


As Michael said Sony stopped letting people both crunch and play games on the PS3, you could do one or the other, but not both. It is unlikely they would do a complete turn around with the PS4, that makes the PS4 an expensive cruncher. Even the US Army was using Ps3's for their Linux capabilities, when Sony stopped letting them turn them back into gaming machines the Army stopped buying them. NOT because they wanted to play games, but because they were not viable on the 2nd hand market anymore when they were done with them. Essentially they became expensive, non upgradeable computers!

sHENzheN
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Message 70843 - Posted: 13 Nov 2013 | 15:49:58 UTC - in response to Message 70840.

Hmm so this all hinges on Sony allowing linux or some OS to be used for distributed computed such as Primegrid then. Million dollar question is when can we know? Perhaps as soon as the PS4 is released will people perhaps tinker with it and find out.

If PS4 could run BONIC, would it affect what is happening PrimeGrid in the sense that more work could be done?

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Message 70872 - Posted: 14 Nov 2013 | 12:07:53 UTC - in response to Message 70843.

Hmm so this all hinges on Sony allowing linux or some OS to be used for distributed computed such as Primegrid then. Million dollar question is when can we know? Perhaps as soon as the PS4 is released will people perhaps tinker with it and find out.

If PS4 could run BONIC, would it affect what is happening PrimeGrid in the sense that more work could be done?


Sorta kinda...Sony will ALWAYS allow their game platforms to run Linux, the key is whether you can ALSO play games on it or not! Under the PS3 they allowed you to do one OR the other, NOT BOTH. So if you wanted to play games you could NEVER boot into Linux and crunch, if you wanted to crunch you could NEVER go back and play games again!!

We will know after it is released and some people try it and it fails, then the alarm will be raised and it either will or won't happen again, depending on whether it works or not. Of course Sony could just tell us, but I would not count on them volunteering that info pre-release on their own. Talking about limitations is not the best PR strategy.

And yes the PS4 could help alot with crunching, but as I said earlier it is an expensive cruncher. Sony uses their own type of chips and then uses them to their utmost, but that means it does what Sony wants it to do very well, and not much else. So yes it should be able to crunch one kind of unit very well, but not necessarily all kinds of units very well. As the units change though the Sony could easily be less and less useful over time.

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Message 71146 - Posted: 27 Nov 2013 | 4:27:00 UTC

The biggest issue I could foresee is the vulnerablity to the PS4's online community. Microsoft went through leaps and bounds to prevent xbox modders from gaining a competetive edge on other players. The downside is you have to pay for service but they keep a large staff primarily for booting off people who cheat. This stabilty is what made xbox live flourish over the PS3's online gaming. I live and breath sony so don't knock me for saying this, but xbox live was far superior to Playstation network. Sony wants to change that with PS4, and I could see them preventing people from tampering with firmware and being able to connect.

What would be awesome, is a BOINC coded to work in the PS4 operating enviromnent, and available to download in the Playstation store. Much like Netflix, that music app they had, and other downloadable games, just select it from the XMB (or whatever they're calling now). Maybe some programmers could come up with something and with enough backing it could be possible.

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Discovered 1 mega prime321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,038,739)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,074,615)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,013,823)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,142,353)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,149,318)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,049,284)SoB LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,043,824)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,053,250)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,095,282)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,025,737)Woodall LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,751,692)321 Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (23,770,672)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (944,431)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,813,253)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (339,648,557)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,446,797)AP 26/27 Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (33,140,471)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (36,404,380)PSA Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,457,430)
Message 71155 - Posted: 27 Nov 2013 | 12:56:38 UTC - in response to Message 71146.

The biggest issue I could foresee is the vulnerablity to the PS4's online community. Microsoft went through leaps and bounds to prevent xbox modders from gaining a competetive edge on other players. The downside is you have to pay for service but they keep a large staff primarily for booting off people who cheat. This stabilty is what made xbox live flourish over the PS3's online gaming. I live and breath sony so don't knock me for saying this, but xbox live was far superior to Playstation network. Sony wants to change that with PS4, and I could see them preventing people from tampering with firmware and being able to connect.

What would be awesome, is a BOINC coded to work in the PS4 operating enviromnent, and available to download in the Playstation store. Much like Netflix, that music app they had, and other downloadable games, just select it from the XMB (or whatever they're calling now). Maybe some programmers could come up with something and with enough backing it could be possible.


Now that would be cool, when you aren't otherwise using the ps4 you could chose an option to crunch...I LIKE IT!!! Sony could even give out 'credits' for crunching under the Sony Team, kind of like some other sites do. I don't mean you would HAVE to crunch for the Sony Team, just that if you do you would get extra 'credits' towards Sony stuff. ie free game cheats that others get later on.

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The "Shut up already!" badge:  This loud mouth has mansplained on the forums over 10 thousand times!  Sheesh!!!Discovered the World's First GFN-19 prime!!!Discovered 1 mega primeFound 1 prime in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2019 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de Primes321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,822,730)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,005,249)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,009,577)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,145,754)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,409,150)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,197,957)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (34,291,181)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,007,110)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,276,330)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,084,329)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,195,123)321 Sieve Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,061,196)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,170,256)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,059,304)PPS Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (22,885,121)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,035,522)TRP Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,051,121)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,118,303)GFN Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (74,478,271)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (12,445,029)
Message 71156 - Posted: 27 Nov 2013 | 13:40:13 UTC

Not to rain on your parade, but given their actions with regards to BOINC on the PS3, I suspect Sony will do everything possible to prevent people from running BOINC on a PS4. If I were Sony, there would be two big reasons I'd want to exclude BOINC:

1) If BOINC can run, then ANY software can run on the PS4 because it's easy to set up a BOINC project that sends "tasks" with whatever software you want. If they allow BOINC, they've given up all control of what runs on the PS4.

2) Think XBox 360's "red ring of death": Gaming is one thing; running the system at 100% 24/7 stresses the computer a lot more. The last thing they want, especially when the system is brand new and competing against Xbox in the next gen console war is to have PS4's failing because they're crunching instead of playing games. (Red ring of death wasn't caused by crunching, but I'm sure Sony learned from Microsoft's woes. They don't want the same thing to happen to their new console.)


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Discovered 1 mega prime321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,038,739)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,074,615)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,013,823)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,142,353)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,149,318)PSP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,049,284)SoB LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,043,824)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,053,250)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,095,282)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,025,737)Woodall LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,751,692)321 Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (23,770,672)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (944,431)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,813,253)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (339,648,557)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,446,797)AP 26/27 Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (33,140,471)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (36,404,380)PSA Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (20,457,430)
Message 71175 - Posted: 28 Nov 2013 | 12:35:39 UTC - in response to Message 71156.

Not to rain on your parade, but given their actions with regards to BOINC on the PS3, I suspect Sony will do everything possible to prevent people from running BOINC on a PS4. If I were Sony, there would be two big reasons I'd want to exclude BOINC:

1) If BOINC can run, then ANY software can run on the PS4 because it's easy to set up a BOINC project that sends "tasks" with whatever software you want. If they allow BOINC, they've given up all control of what runs on the PS4.

2) Think XBox 360's "red ring of death": Gaming is one thing; running the system at 100% 24/7 stresses the computer a lot more. The last thing they want, especially when the system is brand new and competing against Xbox in the next gen console war is to have PS4's failing because they're crunching instead of playing games. (Red ring of death wasn't caused by crunching, but I'm sure Sony learned from Microsoft's woes. They don't want the same thing to happen to their new console.)


Party pooper....here I was hoping I had a way to get back to PS? crunching and gaming, oh well. You are of course correct!

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Message 71563 - Posted: 23 Dec 2013 | 14:24:40 UTC - in response to Message 71156.

Why is it important to be able to control what the user can do with his own Ps4? I know the here's probably an easy answer to this but again Im a layman to this stuff and see only (like most men) the big picture and not so much on the little details :P

Also I wouldn't run the system 24/7(Im not that hardcore) but I'd run it 8 to 12 hours daily and let it rest the rest of the time. In my case I dont game anymore and the purchase of a ps4 would be to crunch basically however in reality most people who do buy a ps4 want bang for there buck and use it for multipurpose reasons. Considering that the vast majority of ps4s that need to be repaired will be mostly due to gaming not number crunching I kinda dont believe sony will be too worried about millions upon millions of people using there ps4 consoles for crunching which would make them allowing BONIC to be used on their ps4's. Still other reasons do seem valid and if what they did with the ps3 is of any evidence its that perhaps Sony will do the same with ps4 and not allow it to be used for crunching. Still I'd like to finally find out once and for all if the ps4 can be used for computing on primegrid and if so that be the day Id run on next door to hong kong (I live in Shenzhen China now) and buy me a ps4. If all else fails I got a nice blue ray dvd player to watch movies with the wife right?

Happy holidays.

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Message 71564 - Posted: 23 Dec 2013 | 14:47:31 UTC

Generally console maker make a loss on the actual machine, but compensate that with lots of profit on the games and add-on products. If you are able to run whatever operating system and software on it, chances are you won't buy their high profit items.
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The "Shut up already!" badge:  This loud mouth has mansplained on the forums over 10 thousand times!  Sheesh!!!Discovered the World's First GFN-19 prime!!!Discovered 1 mega primeFound 1 prime in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2019 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de Primes321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,822,730)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,005,249)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,009,577)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,145,754)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,409,150)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,197,957)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (34,291,181)SR5 LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,007,110)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,276,330)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,084,329)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,195,123)321 Sieve Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,061,196)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,170,256)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,059,304)PPS Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (22,885,121)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,035,522)TRP Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,051,121)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,118,303)GFN Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (74,478,271)PSA Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (12,445,029)
Message 71565 - Posted: 23 Dec 2013 | 15:19:27 UTC - in response to Message 71563.

Still I'd like to finally find out once and for all if the ps4 can be used for computing on primegrid and if so that be the day Id run on next door to hong kong (I live in Shenzhen China now) and buy me a ps4. If all else fails I got a nice blue ray dvd player to watch movies with the wife right?

Happy holidays.


Definitely do not buy a PS4 with the expectation that you'll be able to crunch with it. Even if somehow that becomes possible in the future, I'd still recommend not buying one since SONY could, at any time, remove that ability the way they did with the PS3.


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ID: 276108
Credit: 185,028
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PSP LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (31,378)SoB LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (88,331)TRP LLR Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (36,966)
Message 71592 - Posted: 26 Dec 2013 | 6:14:28 UTC - in response to Message 71565.

Yeah thats the problem if they taken the carpet right from under me I got a glorified dvd player ha ha

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Posts: 86
ID: 91898
Credit: 104,511,361
RAC: 0
321 LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (650,015)Cullen LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (820,374)ESP LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (550,246)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (607,632)PPS LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,612,815)PSP LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (539,445)SoB LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (627,950)SR5 LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,023,449)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,389,355)TRP LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (523,441)Woodall LLR Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (718,450)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,084,280)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (510,148)PPS Sieve Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (41,708,032)TRP Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (560,644)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,336,760)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (32,885,067)PSA Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (357,578)
Message 71697 - Posted: 29 Dec 2013 | 21:18:31 UTC

NOT a game changer: The Playstation 4 :D

like said before, Sony will probably not allow BOINC.

And even if that happens, let's have a look at the hardware (specs)
- 8 core jaguar AMD x86-64 (2x quad-core)
- 8 GB GDDR5

Sound cool eh? Well, it seems that these cores are build for tablets and mobile devices (source).

Quite some discussion on Jaguar (ps4/xbone) vs Intel i5/i7 -> 1 , 2.

Yet the conclusion is the same, the raw CPU-power of the PC cannot be matched by the PS4/XBone.
So if you are going to crunch Primes, then use the PC :)
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ID: 33689
Credit: 683,522,053
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Discovered 3 mega primes321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,921,665)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,917,119)ESP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,517,704)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,717,201)PPS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (30,566,458)PSP LLR Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (11,000,584)SoB LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (23,509,455)SR5 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,946,110)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,378,393)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (3,539,919)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,254,369)321 Sieve Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,634,338)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (360,397)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,801,060)PPS Sieve Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (77,103,903)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,364,469)TRP Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,845,234)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (7,241,013)GFN Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (470,656,239)PSA Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (246,526)
Message 73727 - Posted: 23 Feb 2014 | 21:22:26 UTC - in response to Message 71563.

Why is it important to be able to control what the user can do with his own Ps4? I know the here's probably an easy answer to this


Actually, there is an easy answer. They sell the hardware at cost or a slight loss and plan to make it up by the purchase of games - which have licensing fees for every game sold. The old razor/razor blade analogy applies here.

If you are buying the console with the sole intention of doing anything other than gaming on it, then they are loosing money.

As the old adage goes, follow the money and 99% of the time the motivation for someones actions will become clear.

Message boards : General discussion : The game changer: The Playstation 4

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