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Message boards : Number crunching : GPU advice

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Profile AleksanderProject donor
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Credit: 503,760,767
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321 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,554,522)Cullen LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,512,447)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,107,901)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,020,168)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,086,320)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,523,417)SoB LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,914,761)SR5 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,546,019)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,286,717)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,546,256)Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,640,545)321 Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,001,325)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,154,070)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,773,617)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (200,067,959)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,032,005)TRP Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,738,523)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,011,707)GFN Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,009,419)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,900,000)PSA Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (173,333,070)
Message 25924 - Posted: 27 Aug 2010 | 13:14:23 UTC

I would like to add to one of my older computer GPU capable of PPS CUDA Sieving.

This is desktop integra (E5200, 2GB RAM, WinXP @ Asrock 4CORE-1333-FULLHD), with rather weak PSU (TAGAN TG350-U33I). I do not want heat and noise problem with this PC, especially it is mostly used by my wife :-) I have figured out GeForce GT240, it is not power hungry (max.70W) and rather cheap...seems a perfect solution for me.

Now comes the question - There are few versions with different core/memory speed (550/3400MHz vs 585/3780MHz), different memory type (DDR3 vs DDR5), different memory size (512MB vs 1024MB).

What version should I choose for PrimeGrid application? Which parameters should improve performance and which are just a marketing?
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Scott BrownProject donor
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Discovered the World's First base 116 Generalized Cullen prime!!!Discovered 55 mega primesEliminated 7 conjecture "k"sDiscovered 1 Sophie Germain pairDiscovered 2 Fermat divisors2012 Tour de Primes highest prime count2012 Tour de Primes most Mountain Stage primes2015 Tour de Primes highest prime count2016 Tour de Primes highest prime countFound 23 primes in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 2 primes in the 2018 Tour de Primes Mountain Stage2019 Tour de Primes highest prime countFound 22 primes in the 2019 Tour de Primes2020 Tour de Primes highest prime scoreFound 21 primes in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 4 mega primes in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 8 primes in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 21 primes in the 2022 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2022 Tour de PrimesFound 2 primes in the 2022 Tour de Primes Mountain Stage321 LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (222,511,049)Cullen LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (201,409,561)ESP LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (214,825,147)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (211,275,450)PPS LLR Double Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000,000 credits (1,026,023,749)PSP LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (216,870,883)SoB LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (207,028,068)SR5 LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (245,832,645)SGS LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (218,387,740)TPS LLR (retired) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (235,439)TRP LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (259,244,126)Woodall LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (201,651,344)321 Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (235,451,253)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (83,794,448)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (285,139,652)PPS Sieve Double Ruby: Earned 2,000,000,000 credits (3,042,810,433)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (203,523,358)TRP Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (201,489,157)AP 26/27 Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (528,608,613)GFN Double Ruby: Earned 2,000,000,000 credits (2,497,975,933)WW Double Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000,000 credits (5,006,456,000)PSA Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (259,058,048)
Message 25937 - Posted: 27 Aug 2010 | 16:13:37 UTC - in response to Message 25924.

The GT 240 is good choice for small PSU's. Note that you might also find one of the later 9800GT "green" models that will run a bit faster with similar power requirements.

Shader clock is the most important thing, but you can probably overclock the 550 to 585 easily (factory OC cards are a good choice since they have been stress tested at the higher rates already). I went with the 512 of GDDR5 when choosing my GT 240. That was back on the AP26 app, and the faster memory did provide a small extra boost in speed with that application. Whether that is true of the current PPS sieve app is not yet clear. 512 is also plenty for the applications which can easily run on 256 without issue, so that is not a decision point.


____________
141941*2^4299438-1 is prime!


Profile AleksanderProject donor
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Joined: 15 Apr 10
Posts: 32
ID: 58742
Credit: 503,760,767
RAC: 17,898
321 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,554,522)Cullen LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,512,447)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,107,901)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,020,168)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,086,320)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,523,417)SoB LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,914,761)SR5 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,546,019)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,286,717)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,546,256)Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,640,545)321 Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,001,325)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,154,070)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,773,617)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (200,067,959)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,032,005)TRP Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,738,523)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,011,707)GFN Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,009,419)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,900,000)PSA Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (173,333,070)
Message 25940 - Posted: 27 Aug 2010 | 18:04:22 UTC

Thank you Scott for advice!

Based on results from thread about CUDA PPS Sieve, the difference between GT240 and GT9800GT (ECO or not) is huge:

Nvidia GT 240 2,150s 35.8m Win7 HP 64-bit
Nvidia 9800 GT 1,554s 25.9m Win7 64-bit

26min vs 35min is about 30% difference....

However I have checked GPUgrid forum for their advice and found comment, which mentions other aspect:

"The GT240 is better because it has Compute Capability 1.2, so it is better with CUDA. This is despite the fact that it only has 96 shaders. The 9800GT has 112 shaders, is often clocked higher and is a better card for playing games - it is not as good for crunching here. So the advice for people wanting to get a basic card to crunch with is to get a GT240."

At other Primegrid threads I saw suggestions that single-precision is the key for GPU running sieving application. So no extra bonus from Compute Capability 1.2, right? Is it gonna change soon, or maybe there are some plans to use Compute Capability 1.2 in near future? In that case should I stick with GT240 rather than GT9800 ?
____________

Scott BrownProject donor
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Joined: 17 Oct 05
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Credit: 15,569,567,557
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Discovered the World's First base 116 Generalized Cullen prime!!!Discovered 55 mega primesEliminated 7 conjecture "k"sDiscovered 1 Sophie Germain pairDiscovered 2 Fermat divisors2012 Tour de Primes highest prime count2012 Tour de Primes most Mountain Stage primes2015 Tour de Primes highest prime count2016 Tour de Primes highest prime countFound 23 primes in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 2 primes in the 2018 Tour de Primes Mountain Stage2019 Tour de Primes highest prime countFound 22 primes in the 2019 Tour de Primes2020 Tour de Primes highest prime scoreFound 21 primes in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 4 mega primes in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 8 primes in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 21 primes in the 2022 Tour de PrimesFound 1 mega prime in the 2022 Tour de PrimesFound 2 primes in the 2022 Tour de Primes Mountain Stage321 LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (222,511,049)Cullen LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (201,409,561)ESP LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (214,825,147)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (211,275,450)PPS LLR Double Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000,000 credits (1,026,023,749)PSP LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (216,870,883)SoB LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (207,028,068)SR5 LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (245,832,645)SGS LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (218,387,740)TPS LLR (retired) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (235,439)TRP LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (259,244,126)Woodall LLR Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (201,651,344)321 Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (235,451,253)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (83,794,448)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (285,139,652)PPS Sieve Double Ruby: Earned 2,000,000,000 credits (3,042,810,433)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (203,523,358)TRP Sieve (suspended) Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (201,489,157)AP 26/27 Double Gold: Earned 500,000,000 credits (528,608,613)GFN Double Ruby: Earned 2,000,000,000 credits (2,497,975,933)WW Double Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000,000 credits (5,006,456,000)PSA Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (259,058,048)
Message 25944 - Posted: 27 Aug 2010 | 21:06:18 UTC - in response to Message 25940.


I wouldn't worry about the compute capability here. There is very little difference in 1.1 vs. 1.2 (GPUGRID is the only project I know where that matters). Here at PG, the PPS app can use any compute capability, even the oldest 1.0 cards. The old AP26 app needed only 1.1 capability. I would not expect PG would require it any time soon if ever, but some of the developers would be better at answering that question definitively. Also, 1.2 is only single-precision just like 1.1; you would need 1.3 or one of the Fermi cards for double precision (and on a side note, the Nvidia DP is much, much slower than ATI's, so projects needing it generally develop ATI apps as well).

As for the 9800GT being "much" faster than the GT240, I'd say not so much. The GT240 shader clocks are really low (1340 as I recall) compared to higher clocks for the 9800GT. If you could clock the 240 up to the 1700-1800 range, the difference--though still to the advantage of the 9800--would be much more modest. For example, the 96 shader 9600 GSO on the list in the other thread is indeed mine and has factory OC on the shaders at 1750. It is still slower than the 9800, but not by too much (about 29min vs. about 26min).


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141941*2^4299438-1 is prime!


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Discovered 1 mega primeFound 2 primes in the 2018 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2019 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2020 Tour de PrimesFound 1 prime in the 2021 Tour de PrimesFound 3 primes in the 2022 Tour de Primes321 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,148,133)Cullen LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,022,806)ESP LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,657,625)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Amethyst: Earned 1,000,000 credits (1,251,083)PPS LLR Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (28,493,981)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,182,638)SoB LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,923,035)SR5 LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,603,308)SGS LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,139,194)TPS LLR (retired) Bronze: Earned 10,000 credits (19,376)TRP LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,520,745)Woodall LLR Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,021,413)321 Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,915,071)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,584,236)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (2,461,309)PPS Sieve Emerald: Earned 50,000,000 credits (97,322,801)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Silver: Earned 100,000 credits (352,129)TRP Sieve (suspended) Gold: Earned 500,000 credits (776,202)AP 26/27 Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,368,553)GFN Sapphire: Earned 20,000,000 credits (40,451,682)WW Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (17,224,000)PSA Ruby: Earned 2,000,000 credits (4,154,617)
Message 25945 - Posted: 27 Aug 2010 | 21:40:57 UTC

For PPSieve, (the the PPSE sieve app):


  • RAM speed doesn't matter much.
  • RAM type doesn't matter much because RAM speed doesn't matter much.
  • Compute capability minor revisions don't matter. (CC 2.0 gets a speed boost, but that's just because Fermi handles multiplications better.)

I should point out that there's a guy who's been working on primality proving with GPUs! He's gotten it to work with Mersenne numbers, but not like LLR with our numbers - yet. If he manages to make an LLR for GPUs, it will require double precision: that's compute capability 1.3 or higher.

Finally, how long can you wait? I've been working on an OpenCL version of PPSieve for ATI. It's going well. :) An ATI card might suit your heat and power requirements better. But I don't know how fast it would work yet. I don't have an ATI card to test on, just like I don't have an nVIDIA card to test on, largely because I've been putting off the decision until I see if ATI can work better.

There's a good chance that any hypothetical GPU LLR app wouldn't work on ATI.
____________

Profile AleksanderProject donor
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321 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,554,522)Cullen LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,512,447)ESP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,107,901)Generalized Cullen/Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,020,168)PPS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (9,086,320)PSP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (6,523,417)SoB LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,914,761)SR5 LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,546,019)SGS LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,286,717)TRP LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,546,256)Woodall LLR Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,640,545)321 Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,001,325)Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (15,154,070)Generalized Cullen/Woodall Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,773,617)PPS Sieve Double Silver: Earned 200,000,000 credits (200,067,959)Sierpinski (ESP/PSP/SoB) Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,032,005)TRP Sieve (suspended) Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,738,523)AP 26/27 Jade: Earned 10,000,000 credits (10,011,707)GFN Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (8,009,419)WW Turquoise: Earned 5,000,000 credits (5,900,000)PSA Double Bronze: Earned 100,000,000 credits (173,333,070)
Message 25988 - Posted: 29 Aug 2010 | 9:57:54 UTC

After considering provided facts and advices I have purchased ZOTAC GT240 512MB DDR5 AMP!® Edition. It has by default: shaders running 1460 MHz, core 600MHz, memory 4000MHz plus additional HDMI port (w/audio). Those are factory settings and I paid about 60 Euro including delivery, so I am more than happy.

As for ATI and OpenCL development - HD 6xxx expected to be announced around Q4 2010, so maybe prices of the other Radeons fall after the release?
With hopefully lowered prices and confirmation about availability of GPU work from Primegrid for ATI I could reconsider another purchase :-)
____________

Message boards : Number crunching : GPU advice

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